If they can no longer plant tiger muskies in pineview, and they need a predator…What about northern pike?..Are they susceptable to the same disease as the tigers?..Would that be a good fit?
I know nothing about tiger musky, and I haven’t really followed them in pineview. Why can’t they plant them there anymore?
I’ve already heard of the DWR wanting to stock sterile Northerns in place of Tiger Musky for now. Non-sterile Northerns would probably not be the best. Not as easy to controll fish populations. They also won’t grow nearly as large as Tiger Musky. But one upside is that Northerns are supposed to be a lot easier to catch.
It’s a flesh eating bacteria that spread through our old suppliers back east. A few different diseases are spreading like wild fire out there, and luckilly Utah has avoided all of them. It doesn’t really matter what species, these diseases are bad news.
Northern pike would reproduce like crazy and the fishery would likely crash after a few years.
From what I understand and what I have read in books and on the internet, tiger muskie do not grow as big as either the purebred muskie or the purebred northern pike. In fact, in terms of world records (If the book I read is correct), the record tiger muskie is smaller than the record pike and the record muskie. Maybe pike aren’t as big as tigers in Utah but they have potential to be bigger than any tiger. Pike also reproduce quickly and are much more aggresive than either the muskie or tiger muskie. They have the potential to really wreak havoc on a lake but they are also easily fished out due to their aggressive nature. I personnally love fishing for pike. Tiger muskie are beautiful but they can be really finicky and sometimes hard to catch from what I have seen. I think that northerns would be a great way to replace the tigers in Pineview. I also think that if the DWR allowed more lenient size restrictions on the pike and also allowed the use of whole fish as bait, that the population of pike could be controlled. I guess the only downside is that once they are there, you will have an aweful time removing them if you decide that you don’t want them. At least with tigers, they aren’t supposed to reproduce.
From what I understand, the found another source for stocking more tigers, has anyone else heard this as well?
I guess the only downside is that once they are there, you will have an aweful time removing them if you decide that you don’t want them. quote]
That is one huge downside, plus you will have them in Willard Bay and all of the waters in between!
Aren’t the pike in Yuba of the sterile variety?..What’s to reproduce?
No, the Tiger Musky’s are sterile.
Aren’t the pike in Yuba of the sterile variety?..What’s to reproduce?
The northern pike in Yuba and Redmond are not sterile.
**The pike in Yuba are DEFINITELY NOT sterile. Their population exploded as soon as the drained lake came back up and there was no competition from other predators. **
it only takes a couple of healthy non-sterile northern pike to begin a “hostile takeover” of almost any lake. There are several lakes in Colorado, a couple in California and at least one lake in Arizona that have really suffered from the illegal and unauthorized introduction of northern pike. They very quickly become top predator and often wipe out the previously maintained species.
And, as I understand it, the sterilization program is not 100% effective. So, if 5,000 “sterilized” pike were planted in Pineview, with even a 1% fertile rate, that would be 50 pike that could start a chain reaction to wipe out the perch, crappies and smallmouth.
DWR had a news release on their web page this last week still looking for disease free sources of muskellunge (the other half of the itger muskie cross). They have not been able to locate any sources yet. They are looking at STERILE Northern Pike from Recapture Res. for stocking in the future if not able to find a muskellunge source. Get on the DWR’s webpage and look at the Tiger Muskie Challenges in the latest news section on the bottom of the page.
TD is right that the sterilization process is not fool proof but may be another opportunity for all of us.
cb
There is ponds just west of the gun rang on 21 street and 5600 west that the DWR is planing to make in to a hatchery to raise their own tiger muskellunge…
Hopefully they find a way to stock more tigers soon. I really enjoy catching them and seeing them. If they switch to pike though, I will still be happy. I love how aggressive pike are and I would love to catch a few big pike.
If they can control them that’s one thing…If they can’t that’s another…What I’m referring to is the article… http://wildlife.utah.gov/news/08-05/tm.php
The tiger muskies are half pike anyhow…All it takes is for some yo-yo to throw a non sterile pair of pike in the water.
It just seems that the lake would support more northerns as they don’t get as large as the muskies, but only if they can control them.
I’m glad to see the DWR getting into warm water hatcheries though…It’s about time.
The whole point of tigers was to have a trophy fishery. A bunch of 20" pike would be a lost cause. Tigers or nothing.[;)]
OK! … The state of Minnesota indicates that tiger muskies are usually sterile…Is that like being a little bit pregnant?
http://www.dnr.state.mn.us/fish/northern/biology.html
Sterile stocking is a success with tiger trout, wipers, and tiger muskie…But, if tiger muskie cannot be stocked, because of the disease, what’s the alternative?
- - Personally I hope they never stock another Tiger in Pineview lol. I hate them things.
Some hybrid species are capable of reproduction, if the original parents were close enough genetically…and other factors. Examples would be different strains of cutthroat or rainbows…or even cuttbows. The hybrids can reproduce…with other hybrids or others from their original parent species.
Many other hybrids just don’t work out and are not worth the time, effort and money to propagate. Brownbows are an example. Not a high survival rate and no special qualities to justify the effort. Purty but not practical.
As a general rule of biology, hybrids from differing species are seldom able to reproduce with other similar hybrids. However, some can “cross back” with one or both parent species…if those parents are around at spawning time…or if they are respawned in a controlled laboratory environment.
With tiger muskies, males are almost always sterile. However, some females can produce fertile eggs. Theoretically, they could reproduce with either male muskies or northerns…reducing the hybrid genes in the offspring.
Never say never. Right now, the former source of muskie eggs is “off limits” because of the VHS disease in the area from which we got the eggs. But, Utah DWR has located other potential sources and is going through the checkout process. Once we have a certified disease free source of eggs, we have plenty of northern stock from which to obtain the male contribution and can produce our own tigers. The “warm water” hatchery for Utah has been located and is in the final approval and funding stages.
We got along without tiger muskies for a lotta years. But, now that we have grown to know and love them, we don’t want to lose them. My personal prediction is that by the time the current supply is approaching the “end of days” there will be a new source available.
The best we can do for the present is to all practice careful handling and release procedures, to insure that the fish we play with will live to fight another day. Although tigers are tough on the end of the line, they are wimps when it comes to handling stress. They are their own worst enemies when brought to the boat. They thrash and roll and cause a lot of damage to themselves…bruising, internal organ damage, loss of protective mucus coating and shredded fins and tail. And, the longer they are immobilized…for gloating, picture taking, etc…the more lactic acid builds up in their tissues from stress and exhaustion…and the harder it is to completely revive them.
There are guidelines in the Proclamation and online (DWR pages) that provide suggestions for careful handling and release. Bottom line is that we should not even lift them from the water if avoidable. Control them with a cradle net if you have to, but not with a hoop net…especially one with nylon mesh. And if you must hold one for a picture, cradle them horizontally in your arms…and do it fast. And…do not just dump them back in the water. Hold them by the tail and work them back and forth in the water to aerate the gills. When they are ready to go they will kick their tail and swim away.
If tiger muskies are no longer a possibility, for whatever reason, DWR will have to make the call on what is a viable alternative on a water by water basis. There are many factors to consider and those decisions are best left to the biologists…not adrenaline junkie anglers.
You afraid of loosing a couple cheap plastic worms?[:p]