LOCKED In defense of "The Mack Pack"

Utah Fishing Reports & Discussion Utah Fishing General
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LOCKEAt the end of the thread titled “Flaming Gorge Report”, TubeDude locked the thread, but before doing so took some personal shots at “the Mack Pack.” Since the thread is locked there is no way to responds to those attacks there, so I’ll do it here.

No, TubeDude, those who advocate catch and release of those 30+ year old fish do not do it because **“**They seem to feel that the macks are there only for their pleasure and that nobody else has a right to fish them or keep them…even within the prescribed limits…” as you charge. We advocate catch and release because we want to see that very unique resource at Flaming Gorge around for decades to come so that everyone can enjoy the thrill of catching one of those magnificent animals. And with increasing population, increasing pressure from more anglers who are more sophisticated and have better equipment, if we anglers don’t protect the resource voluntarily it will disappear.

Nobody criticized the person who posted the report. We did criticize the “guide” involved. He is notorious for killing those fish in staggering numbers. Just last year he posted on this board that in the preceding year he had personally cleaned over 100 lake trout in excess of 20 pounds! I would think even you would agree that number is disgusting.

So, in the interest of fair play I hope you will allow this rebuttal to remain. Because you’re dead wrong about us who want to see these fish released instead of killed for the smoker or the wall.

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I don’t see how TD took a shot at the mack pack? I think he hit it right on the head. The guy post his report on the Gorge and kept his catch which he stated and defended to be legal and a certain few throw a fit about it? What gives?

I enjoy catching and releasing bass. I’ve seen guys down at Powell in the past with limits of SMB and LMB in the mix at the cleaning station while taking care of stripers. Ya, it’s not my thing to do, but who am I to call the guy or guys out on it. It wouldn’t be my buisness to do so. To each there own right?[crazy]

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its information thats what gives. if the guide told people they were as old as they are moore would not keep them. i want my grand kids grand kids to have a shot at it just as i have. thats what gives. another thing and even a bigger threat to the fish in fg is the burbot. they have been caught for the last 2yrs on the laker beds in december when the lakers are spawning. think for 1 second they are eating crawdads at 85 to 100 ft? no its eggs, laker eggs. we dont want to have to go clear to great bear in canada for world class fish for us and you and your own if you choose the big fish will be waiting for you.[;)] if we do not say anthing we are in a small way just as responsable if it goes away.

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if you want to keep some fish there are plenty of other specices in the gorge to eat besides them big old boys if you want them mounted take measurments,and have hookjaws wood carver make ya a fish.it makes me sick to see them old fish kept and they are horrible to eat like a big pice of fat the five pounders are much better.and that keep it clean (edit by kentofnsl) guide can put them on all of them the want to take home.

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In MY opinion and most laker fisherman will agree is, If these 20+ pound fish are kept on a daily basis. then the bigger lake trout will decline on a rapid rate. I know 3-4 people that have been with the guide mentioned, and have not been encourage to let the fish go. I was at a recent DWR meeting and they are already concerned about the lake trout with the introduction of the burbout in the Gorge. So I think that everyone including this guide should take that in to consideration when fishing the Gorge for lakers.

Fishman, do you think those SMB and LMB that these fishermen are taking out of powell have been in there for 20 to 30 years? I fish a lot of different lakes and catch and release 95% of everything I catch, but it doesn’t bother me if people catch there limit, cause most of fish they catch have only been in the lake a short time.

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Wow. That’s pretty deep. I would be knocking on your door in the morning if I was “that guide”. I don’t mean to get into a peeing contest here, but how can people get so wound up about people legally harvesting a fish? [sly] What if I was to think the 5 pounders were trophies to me and you shouldn’t keep those? What do you think? I mean geez, if you put back that 5 pounder it might be a 30 pounder one day.

I personally wouldn’t keep a large mack either, but I sure is hell wouldn’t run people down for choosing to take one home. If it is really that upsetting why isn’t there any groups or persons at a RAC meeting or any where else besides BFT spouting there spew about it? If I felt so strong about people taking a big Mack home, I would spend more time trying to propose changes with the rules and regs that the UDWR or Wyo Game and Fish put out instead of talking the talk on the WWW. That’s my two cents. Hey BigBuck, don’t turn people on to keeping the Bass at the Gorge, they are fun toys don’t you know.[;)]

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and they are very tasty and didnt take 30 years to grow. i luv a good fillet of bass but i dont chomp down on the five pounders.if you even knew anything about the gorge yad know even you an catch a cooler fuller of pups.

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Personal Shots Don?

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and they are very tasty and didnt take 30 years to grow. i luv a good fillet of bass but i dont chomp down on the five pounders.if you even knew anything about the gorge yad know even you an catch a cooler fuller of pups.
But what about the future of our kids and grandkids and such if we take coolers of pups?:astonished: BTW, I never said i knew or didn’t know the Gorge, what difference does it make? My point is to each there own. Enough said, I’m done.

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Personal Shots Don?

What’s the matter, Duk? Feeling lonely without me over there?

I don’t mind personal shots as long as I have the right to set the record straight. Send me an email or PM if you’d like to discuss further in private.

Tight lines, Duk

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LONG LIVE LARGE LAKE TROUT!!!

CATCH AND RELEASE THE BIG ONES.

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Wow! I’ve only caught a couple mac’s in my life, they weren’t that big (in comparison) but if keeping the big mackinaw is such an issue why isn’t there something in the proclamation to protect them? I understand that they have been in there a long time but the average angler is going to keep that ‘big fish’ and why not? It is in their right according to the law.
You all can be informative as you want but untill the proclamation says different all your doing is offering suggestions but I never hear anything done about it. I’m always hearing about the guy that kept the big mack and how he should know better and how ignorant he must be, etc. How about hearing about what YOU are doing about it instead of ranting on about some guy who kept a big fish, I’m becoming numb to the same bs year after year. I’m no biologist but if the DWR was concerned than they would change the laws. 2 cents.

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Don,

Thanks for setting the record straight for the many of us that fish for large Mac’s on the gorge, but NEVER harvest any Mac over 12lbs. I have caught many Mac’s in the 30 and 40 lb range and all returned safely. The big Mac’s deserve our respect and the opportunity to live another day[/u]. It makes me SICK to see some low life “fisherman” ( guides too) snarring pre-spawn Mac’s in the fall. I have made a point to let my feelings known to a few guides ( and their customers) at the boat ramp and / on the water when I see the big macs being snagged and harvested. While it may be legal to harvest a big Mac, it doesn’t mean its the right thing to do! A simple and quick camera shot should be all that is needed with the big fish and then carefully back into the water and worked by the tail until it powers back down to the depths on its own. I have offered that “guide” up there a nice Camera outfit if he would use it, instead of harvesting. Everyone that I have heard of that tried to eat a large Mac was very disappointed!!! Fish of that size have a lot of fat in them and don’t taste good anyway, so why harvest them or encourage customers to harvest them?

I don’t know exactly what Tube Dude meant, but I do respect his vast knowledge of the sport. I can only hope that he understands that the majority of us that fish the gorge for big Mac’s, don’t fall into the general category he described.
[;)]

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:sunglasses:A voice of reason. Praise be.

I coined the term “mack pack” to describe a core group of BFTers who developed a passion for fishing for large macks…and began to look down their noses at all mere mortals who did not share their “religion”. Most of them were once good friends, but now most of them view me as the “enemy” because I poke fun at them. They all seem to have lost their sense of humor along with their ability to enjoy any other kind of fishing.

I have fished all over the country and caught plenty of macks. Been there, done that, don’t have to keep going back. I have other species I like better. But, I have a healthy respect for them and well understand that they are slow growing and that the big ones are “dinosaurs”…worthy of respect, careful handling and release. Being an avid consumer of fish flesh too, I also understand that there is no good reason to keep a large mack to eat. Edible…but so is a foul tasting old buck deer in rut. There are a lot of other fish better suited to taking home for the table.

I have never said anything derogatory about any of the “mack pack”, nor have I ever challenged their right to state their case. My only beef is the constant sniping at other fishermen who do not share their beliefs…or who exercise their LEGAL right to keep a large fish if they want to. We are all entitled to our own opinions and we have free choice in how we want to fish, for what species and what we want to keep. We do not have the right to attack others or to chastize them on a public forum for doing what they do for their own reasons.

If you wish to “educate” someone who is obviously not as experienced or successful at mack fishing, then do so with an “informational” approach. Don’t blast them with an RPG the first time they post on our board…proud that they have just caught the biggest fish of their lives and want to share it.

I think joining the “mack pack” tends to create a bit of amnesia. Apparently the members can no longer remember when they were mack rookies, begging for help and information from others on how to catch the big ones. I strongly suspect that there were more than a few big fish kept by them in their earlier mack trips. They seem to know a lot about how poor eating the big ones are. All heresay?

I will be the first in line to point out the many reasons why the big fish should be protected better. But, I will stand up for anyone who is attacked for keeping one of them.

**Good points have been made about guides and fishing regulations. Guides make their money by getting clients into big fish. And, if a client wants to keep fish, they will look for a guide that allows them to keep their fish. There are plenty of conservation minded guides on the Gorge, and they do a lot to educate anglers both on proper catching techniques and on how to safely release the fish. **

There are likely to always be guides that teach snagging techniques and participate in fish killing. You can rant and rave all you want on this board about them, but it will accomplish nothing. That is a matter for DWR to regulate and enforce. At this time, macks do not seem to be a high priority item for Utah DWR. You don’t have to like it, but if you want it changed you need to organize and make noise.

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I am as passionate about tiger muskies as you are about your macks, BUT, if i see someone who catches a huge one and wants to keep it then that is their choice. I will never look down on someone who keeps one. I WILL act accordingly if they are poached or taken by any illegal means but i will never look down on a legal harvester. I have kept 2 over 40" in the last 10 years and i can tell you if i catch a fish over 52" i will definitely be keeping it. You have lost the battle on this board for the most part. Go back to Freeform and hang out with your “elitist” buds and nobody will have anything to say about your side of the story. This is the wrong board to keep bringing this up. What i said before still stands. If someone wants to keep a legal fish, WHO THE HELL CARES???[frown]

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:sunglasses:Take it easy on him, Brody. He gets lonely. He has had fewer than 20 posts on his Colorado board so far this month and most of those are from his fellow moderators. He has three other mods to help him handle all the action in Colorado so he has free time to harass the folks in Utah.

He has made it plain that he doesn’t like us, but he can’t find any action anywhere else. And, he used to be a nice guy.

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Is that what SM’s problem was to?[sly]
Isn’t BFT HQ’d in Colorado? That makes no sense???

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:sunglasses:Southernman had his own set of “issues”.

Yes, the HQ for FirstLightNet…our parent company…is in Colorado. But, that does not automatically make the Colorado Board the biggest and best board in the entire network. That takes a bunch of serious fishermen who work together to promote statewide fishing enjoyment…and who know how to make reports and ask questions without having to get personal or challenge fellow members.

**For whatever reason, Utah BFT enjoys a higher percentage of anglers who are computer literate and who are willing to share with others. The sad reality is that there are many states that have great fishing potential, and thousands of anglers, but just do not have the Internet participation we do. We are good and lucky. No discredit to the moderators of any of the other forums. It is tough to build and maintain an active board. **

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i posted there everyday i fished in CO before i came out to UT to see TS. and that is pretty damn odd, because CO has an amazing fishery just like UT does. only reason i post in UT (im from CO) is because i lived there a few times, TS has lived there for years, and i have fished alot of water there.

off topic sorry. im with LH2 by the way.the biggest thing i have caught in my flyrod was a 26-28lb salmon (coincidently we found out that was a state record, anyway) and i kept it. if i were to catch a big ass musky, say 52inches like LH2 says, i would toss it back, but as long as someone does it legally, im all for what ever they want to do.